CCCT with Nick Grandy, Construction and Real Estate Analyst for RSM US LLP Video

CCCT sat down with Nick Grandy, Construction and Real Estate Analyst for RSM US LLP that is the leading provider of assurance, tax and consulting services to the middle market. CCCT sat down with Nick Grandy, Construction and Real Estate Analyst for RSM US LLP that is the leading provider of assurance, tax and consulting services to the middle market. With more than 16,600 partners, principals and employees across the U.S. and Canada and 57,000 people across 120 countries through RSM International, their purpose is to deliver the power of being understood to their clients, colleagues and communities. As first-choice advisors, are focused on developing leading professionals and innovative services to meet the clients’ evolving needs in today’s ever-changing business environment.

Through a supportive, caring culture, our people are empowered to be their authentic selves and share their unique perspectives. RSM culture of diversity and inclusion enhances the insights they provide while transforming innovation, collaboration and business results through fostering an inclusive environment, working hard to engage a talented workforce and reflect their diverse community, and developing relationships that serve others in business and the broader community. Together, their people’s individual talents and diverse perspectives strengthen their teams and enhance the unique insights that we provide to their clients.

For more information, visit rsmus.com.

On Twitter: https://twitter.com/RSMUSLLP

On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/rsmusllp/

Transcription

Hey there commercial construction coffee dog fans, thanks for chiming in. My name’s David Corson. I’m your host. I’m also the publisher and editor of Commercial Construction Renovation magazine. I’ve got a little Mike glare on there, my halo, but this is what it used to look like. I’m breaking out the archives. Oh, March-April 2008. John Mose, director of construction for Crate and Barrel. Thanks, John, for being on the cover. Another good-looking issue. Actually, this one was, uh, back in the day. This was 180 pages, nice and thick, looks like a wedding catalog. Let’s see what I was looking at back in my publisher’s page. Oh, got some dogs there. These are some of our rescues, way back when. And, uh, we got a little golden doodle, black lab, and, uh, kind of a mutt. And you know what? They’re all passed, they’re all in urns up on our shelf. But we’re rescuers, and I got four other ones sitting here, and, uh, anyway, but it’s always nice to hold the magazine. We went digital August of 2021. We have White Castle on our last printed magazine that we did, the biggest facility that they’d ever built. But, uh, 100% digital, have tons of people consuming content, and, uh, I had about 29 million people hit the website last year. And, uh, looks like I’m on edge for about another two and a half million this month. And if I continue that momentum, I’m probably gonna be right there. Maybe I’ll go over 30 million, I don’t know. But, uh, everybody out there that’s been hitting our site over the last couple of years and so forth, we really appreciate it. So couldn’t have done it without you. It’s TGIF today, weekend before Labor Day coming up next weekend. Um, in out of Atlanta, Georgia, out by the lake, and it is just beautiful but sizzling, sizzling hot. You know, it’s actually been pretty nice, but the humidity came back today, and, uh, just, uh, just awful, you know? It hits you like a two by four with rusty nails when you go outside. Even my dogs are like, “Oh my God, I gotta, I’m doing my business and I’m coming back in, I’m not gonna sweat.” So anyway, I hope everyone’s had, listen, it’s Friday, weekend time to recharge your battery. You know, got college football starting, you know, high school’s been here, you know, we’ve been in school now for a couple of weeks, you know, with the buses on there. So, my high school’s, uh, down the road, North Gwinnett, and they always have a big time football team. And so, uh, everybody, I’m waiting to hear the drums starting, and, uh, you know, everybody’s gonna go to the stadium and start rooting for the Bulldogs. And, uh, anyway, uh, you got the Braves going, we’re first place, you know, the baseball season’s coming down in the end, there’s a lot of teams that are on the bubble trying to make in, you know, it’s the wild card. And, uh, you got the professional lacrosse league, you know, their tournament is going to start too.

And, uh, and then before you know it, the NHL’s gonna be back on the, back on the ice, and the b-ball guys and the hardwoods. And, uh, in the NFL is going to start, and, you know, you know, everything’s gonna go. But it’s actually kind of been quiet here, you know, over the summer. So, all in all, uh, I can’t complain. And, uh, I’m flying my DU colors as usual, you know, it’s Friday, you know, I got my sticks behind me. So, uh, but it’s been a great week, had a lot of wins, and, you know, big and small, and they all add up. And, uh, just, uh, got a lot of things done off my to-do list, and I’m looking forward to the weekend. You know, in fact, I think my wife and I are probably gonna go out in the boat here, you know, about seven o’clock. And, uh, there’s this little bar restaurant called The Twisted Door up on the lake, and, uh, they got an awesome burgers. I like the BLTs too up there, but, uh, I think that’s where I’m going when I get done, and, uh, she gets home from, she’s a interior designer contract, she’s working.

On a job today, so hopefully I’ll see some pics when she comes home. But, uh, with that said, I’ve saved the best for last of my week, a podcast going. I’ve got a gentleman, he’s in Raleigh, North Carolina, and he’s a first-time dad, just had, you know, his first child a couple of weeks back, so he’s learning all the ropes. Say all the audience out there, commercial construction coffee talk, say hello to Mr. Nick Grandy, and he’s with RSM, and basically, you know, they’re in the financial sector, and they’re consultants and accountants, etc., and have a lot of construction data. And once again, the publicist reached out to me, I was, I was like, “Oh, cool, I got this new report, let’s talk about it, let’s see what Nick schedules,” and boom, here he is. So, Nick, say hello to our audience out there in commercial construction coffee talk.

Hello, everybody, it’s great to be here, and David, thank you for having me. I really appreciate it.

Absolutely, absolutely. And, uh, uh, Nick’s in Yankee, just about, you know, from Beantown, transplanted down into Raleigh, North Carolina, and, uh, you know, enjoying it, and, uh, so, uh, welcome to the South, another Yankee, you know, living down here, so we, you know, we’re invading it, you know, so we gotta stick together, right?

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, you know, I’ve been down here since ’92, so I saw all the Olympics, I saw all the stuff get built, you know, I’ve gone through all the stuff, and, uh, but, uh, it’s so funny in Atlanta, half people aren’t from here, you know, you meet some locals here and there, but I’m from Philly originally, so I still have my twang, it’s kind of gone over the years, but you know, if you go to a, you know, a game, half the stadium’s got the other team’s jerseys on there, you know, it’s crazy, you know, maybe not for the Braves as much, but I’m telling you, anybody comes in there, you see the other jerseys, and you know it’s a melting pot down here, uh, but I do know some locals that have been here forever, which is kind of nice, but a lot of people are transplants, that’s just the reality of it, but listen, Atlanta’s the LA of the South, okay, every Fortune 500 company’s got a, you know, headquarters down here, uh, and, uh, you and we’ve got dealt, and you can go anywhere in the world if you want from, you know, non-stop, and, uh, you know, the world’s busiest airport, right?

Yeah, yeah, I’m a million miler, you know, I, I did my time, and, uh, so, but, uh, anyway, it’s a great town, uh, and, uh, they’ve got so many things to offer, and they got every sports team you can imagine, and, uh, you know, we just lost our hockey team, but we’ve got some minor league teams here, so, uh, all in all. So, Nick, the way that, the way this is going to go is, uh, we do our, our interviews in three parts. You’re gonna tell your story, where you grew up, where you went to school, uh, playing these sports, whatever, and then how you ended up where you are today at RSM, uh, then we’ll talk about the last three years of the roller coaster that we all went through, uh, you know, not by our choice, but we did, and, uh, here we are standing about three and a half years later still discussing it, and, uh, then you’ll leave one positive thought or phrase with, uh, our listeners, your contact info, and, uh, and then we’ll sign off before we all go into the weekend. So, with that said, the floor is yours, tell us your story.

Thanks, David, so yeah, I appreciate the intro and everything, and I do want to say that if you do hear a baby crying or you do hear crying, it might be my wife or the baby, so if it is the wife, we will be certain to, you might see me bolt out real fast, but try to avoid that, we’ll pause when you talk to her, as the baby. I got four dogs, so you know, my wife’s not home yet, and she used to come home, they’re gonna start freaking out, so hopefully we won’t have either one get through this. I also wanted to point out before my PR team yells at me that I am wearing a t-shirt only because it’s Friday, and you know, on Fridays, you have to, you have to support red, right? So, uh, Red’s an acronym, not sure if you’re aware, but remember, it’s, it’s in stands. background. It’s been a big part of who I am. I ski a lot, spent a couple of years doing trips out west. And I’ll tell a little bit of a story about how I ended up in the Raleigh area from Boston. So, grew up in Connecticut. After growing up attending all public school, I went to Bryant University. We went to school for accounting, graduated in three years, then I worked on my Master’s Degree right after because in order to become a CPA, you need to be certified, and in order to be certified, you need to have a certain number of credit hours. So I figured, you know what, I’m in school, graduated early, let’s just get this done. So, went and got my masters at Bryant right after I graduated from undergrad. While I was in my master’s program, sat for the CPA exam, passed it on the first try. It was awesome, right? Not a lot of people do it on the first try, so I was really proud of myself for doing that. But after college, I moved to Boston. So, I started at RSM, and when I joined RSM, they asked me, “What industry do you want to work in?” So, you know, I told you, my dad was an engineer, my brother, who, my brother also is in the construction-adjacent industry, so he works for Milwaukee Power Tools. He’s three years older than me.

So, between my dad and my brother being, you know, in construction-serving industries, I was like, “I want to work in construction. I want to serve our construction clients.” So, I began my career at RSM working in their audit practice, spent nine years working almost exclusively on construction companies, so clients ranging from your small mom-and-pop contractor with four people in total to those super-large ENR top 50 contractors, you know, anything in my Client base at the time ranged from anything from like 10 million in revenue to like 5 billion in revenue, right? So, saw a whole host of different contractors operating in different spaces, from, you know, the subcontractor space, HVAC contractors, utility contractors, you know, roofers, etc., to like your general contractors. So, basically, I’ve seen a whole of the construction industry during my time at RSM. But currently, you know, I recently transitioned from audit to financial consulting. So, in my financial consulting job, I help clients with complex accounting issues and transactions, and I help them just to make improvements to their finance function because finance is not always the easiest thing to do, especially for a construction company or a construction owner who might not have a finance background or is so focused on the operational aspects of it that they really don’t want to handle that, right? They want it to be right, and they need it to make the decisions, but it might not be their forte. So, we’d like to come in and be able to help them. Helped a couple companies recently, one to prepare for an IPO by helping with compiling financial information, financial data, etc., helping them to streamline processes.

Help another company currently helping another company to outsource their entire accounting and finance function. So, basically, it was determined that it would be more efficient if they outsourced all of their functions to a third party. So, helping to prepare for that, like, how can we gain efficiencies on process improvement? How can we improve the speed at which information is transferred throughout the organization? But I’ve also helped companies with post-acquisition mergers. So, anytime a company deals with a merger, going through an acquisition, anytime a company deals with implementation of new accounting standards, which have seemed to be more regular in recent times. So, helping them with those items, especially with some of the larger and more complex accounting standards like the new revenue recognition standard, the new lease standard. You want to make sure you’re in compliance with that. You want to make sure that the bank and your bonding companies and your insurance companies and all of the people that get your financial statements, you know, if you’re on compliance, they don’t want to have any issues, they don’t want to see anything, they want to make sure it’s right, and you know, they can rely on that information. So, helping doing that. And then I also do just general account reconciliation, so helping to prepare account reconciliations, and basically helping to augment staff that might be present at your company to just get more work done or get caught up in your financial reporting cycle, etc. But in 2020, before I switched to this financial consulting role, I also decided that it was time to become a superhero. So, I took on another role at RSM. It’s the construction senior analyst role. So, in that role, I spend my time working with our chief economist. So, like to say that I spend my days fighting for justice in my financial consulting role, which I just explained, and then I spend my nights moonlighting as our construction senior analyst. I hope to forecast business, economic, and technology trends for the construction industry. So, I work with a lot of our construction clients and prospects in the space to help guide them through just kind of where we are currently in both the economic environment, the business environment, helping to give them data-driven analysis.

And I think that’s really how we ended up connecting, David. It’s through that role and through some of the work that I have done there. So, I mean, beyond that, beyond my roles at RSM, told you, you know, I’m a new dad, so I’ve got a six-week-old girl, baby girl. She’s our first. Wife and I are super excited. I probably look exhausted because I am not sleeping a lot because I know that gig. you know, it was a long time, you know, but I mean, uh, I get it, yeah, it’s a lot of changing diapers, you know? I tell my wife, I’m like, there’s not too much I could do, but I can change a mean diaper, so whenever I can help, that’s what I’m doing. But, um, I wanted to tell a story quickly, so, you know, we spent nine years in Boston. My wife and I decided in 2021 that, um, we wanted to go for a little road trip. RSM was in a remote work environment, so we said, “All right, we’re gonna go travel for two months. We’re gonna go out to the Rockies.” So, we rented an Airbnb in the Rockies. Uh, we lived in a little town called Leadville, Colorado. Oh, yeah, yeah, you might be familiar with the Denver shirt and having special, yeah. Rented a place there, and we lived there for two months. And so, after those two months, you know, we skied. I think I skied, like, 21 times that winter. It was awesome. Um, up in all the mountains in Colorado. What was your favorite mountain? I loved Copper. Um, but my favorite all-time on that trip, my favorite all time, though, is Big Sky. Not sure if you’ve been there. Listen, you know, I skied the Saint Mary’s Glacier, I skied everywhere, you know. My favorite mountain was Aspen Highlands, you know, really? Yeah. And, uh, but when I was at DU in the 80s, so they used to have a thing called Ski Americard, and I could ski it during the week, I could ski for a dollar. Uh, Loveland Pass, Arapahoe Basin, Mary Jane, Winter Park, and I could get from DU to the mountains, you know, up, you know, the Eisenhower Tunnel was built by then. I probably could get up there, you know, 45 minutes, you know, depending if there were, you know, if there was bad weather and stuff.

Uh, but, uh, yeah, skied for a dollar, but I skied every mountain, and, uh, my parents had a place in Vail, and, uh, I did the five-year program when I was out there. I was a lacrosse hockey player, but I took one year off and, uh, worked up on the mountain, had my pass, and, uh, it was very, very cool. But out of all the mountains, you know, I saw Beaver Creek get built, and, uh, yeah, when I was younger, my parents used to take me out of school for a month, and we would get tutored, and we used to, we skied in Aspen. I actually learned how to ski, uh, well, technically in Hunter Mountain outside of New York City, but Buttermilk was really where I learned how to ski. As soon as I could get on, you know, I could walk, they put me on skis and skates, that was the gig, yeah, but we didn’t do it, yeah, there’s no other way. No, no. Hey, listen, we know when your daughter starts walking, you know, and gets out of diapers, she’s going to get her skis put on, you know, ski school, and, you know, you pick them up at three, and, you know, so be it, but, uh, yeah, no, it, uh, I have some awesome video of me. I mean, I was a bomber, you know, and I had a wicked video of me going through the bumps in my, in my heyday, but the Aspen Highlands, there was a run called Thunderball at the end of the day, you’d come down Thunderball, and you come right into the parking lot in their little stand, and, you know, it was, you know, it was between Snowmass and Ajax, and Buttermilk was right there, it was kind of tucked away. A lot of people don’t know it, but, uh, yeah, it was awesome. But I skied everywhere. Listen, there’s nothing like the back bowls in Vail when there’s fresh ground, I mean, right, you get, you can’t get better than that. But there’s nothing better than fresh powder, period, right? That’s like a hard stop. I don’t care where you are, as long as you’re on the mountain, it doesn’t matter, right? There was one time, I forget what year it was, it was sometime in the late 80s, and, uh, anyway, it snowed, they closed the mountains. And for those who don’t know, uh, they closed the mountains because all of the animals are gonna, you know, hibernate, make their trip back from the winter, so they closed the mountains basically the third week in April.

basically, right around Easter, they closed the mountains in the Rockies, and, uh, it had snowed so much this one, uh, spring that they reopened Vail for like a week. And not the whole mountain, but I mean it was like up over my waist, there was so much snow, and, um, it was, it was amazing. I mean, it was probably the coolest thing I ever do, other than skiing the glacier. And I was a fraternity guy, an SAE, so we all had, everybody had to go up there and do it. But uh, during my college days on the weekends, I mean, I used to have my fraternity brothers, I mean, there must have been like 20 people sleeping on the floor, my mom didn’t care, you know, and, uh, we, we all get up and, you know, ski party, and I have some, fun, fond memories. But, uh, yeah, Copper, very, very cool, my favorite out there, I think, in Colorado. I mean, in terms of that vocation, but overall, it’s Big Sky, I just love it out in Montana, it’s fantastic. So, and then, I mean, beside that, the other thing, I’m a big golfer, so I know you probably can’t see it, but right here I have my, uh, my hole-in-one award. So, last year, uh, my wife and I were in Arizona, and playing True North Golf Course, their Pinnacle course there, and I was having the worst round of golf in my entire life. And get to the 16th hole and hit the best shot of my life, and you know, watch the ball, it was 129-yard par three, had a pitching wedge, hit it about 10 yards over the pin, watched it spin right back into the hole, and it’s like, you know, that was just a lifetime, life-changing moment, right? Like, you play golf for those types of moments, and it was awesome. All-in-ones, you’re in an elite club.

I mean, there’s some people have several of them, it’s like, getting hit by lightning, you know? Yeah, I, I grew up with a guy, I played golf my entire life, so, you know, I play, basically, bogey, and anyway, uh, I broke 80 once, and that day, uh, I didn’t keep score, we didn’t take any mulligans or anything, and I’m not playing in this foursome, and anyway, so they, you know, we finished the 18th, and they’re like, “Hey, David, man, you know, you shot 79,” and I was like, “No way.” If you counter, I go, “Listen, I want you, I’m taking that card, you need to sign it.” I go, “Right?” I’m so glad you didn’t tell me that, I was, uh, you know, where I was at, because if you would have, I would have shanked the ball in the freaking, uh, river or to the trees and it would have been over. But they didn’t tell me, and then the next thing I knew, I was close, but I, but I really wasn’t, I was just playing a nice round and I really didn’t care. But I’m so glad they didn’t tell me and I still haven’t, it’s in my repertoire here someplace. But, uh, yeah, I’ve never had one, I’m envious. Yeah, it’s great, I mean, it was, it only cost me a thousand five hundred dollars all said and done, so a little hefty on the price tag, but, uh, definitely worth it, you know? Yeah, that’s checked off, that one goal for golf, so very happy that I got, good for you, experience it in life, yeah. So I mean, it’s just an awesome sport and not really love doing it, and hopefully, uh, hopefully my daughter’s into it too, skiing and golf, those are the two things we’re going to try to push her into, yeah. Well, listen, you know, you’ve got some mountains that you can ski down here in the South, it’s not, you know, not, you know, Copper Mountain or anything, but, you know, you can, you can depending on the weather, start her right, get her started, yeah, yeah, you can, you can, uh, you can do a little skiing here in the South, believe it or not. And, uh, uh, plenty of golf courses, you know, like we were talking before, I lived in North Carolina for, you know, about six months, so there were plenty, you know, tracks to go out and, you know, hit the links and stuff. So, uh, you know, well, good for you, you know, you got skiing going, you know, we got a lot in common, you know, we have so much in common, yeah, absolutely, absolutely.

So when your publisher sent me the press release, um, uh, I was gonna say, let’s uh, transition, you know, talking about, you know, the last three years, but you know, you have a construction report that you guys just came out with, that you know. That was in that release that they sent me, and that’s what kind of caught me because everybody right now is in construction. You know you got the labor shortage, if you can find PMS or superintendents. You still have some supply stuff depending on where it’s coming from. And everything is, you know, you got to live and die by your budget. The other thing I was going to tell you is that I always tell people that go into business, if they’re entrepreneurs, there’s three people that you have to have the same vision as you. You want to have a Doctor Who’s going to keep you healthy, you’ve got to have a CPA so you keep the tax man happy, you gotta have, you know, and you gotta have a good attorney, okay? So, you know, those three people are crucial to operating. You know, I don’t care if it’s public or private or, you know, entrepreneurship, you know, those three people are very, very because without your health you can’t work, right? All the legalese that comes in, you know, it’s just crazy and, you know, all these frivolous lawsuits that you know that can happen to you, you know, who knew? And that CPA thing, you know, listen, you know, you gotta listen as an entrepreneur every day I get up, I look in my, uh, I go online and see what’s in my kitty, you know, so yeah, it’s in there. So, and then there’s two certainties, right, death and taxes so you need that CPA to help you.

So, let’s talk about like the last three or so, uh, you know, March 2020, yeah, well, the beginning of 2020 we’re booming, low unemployment, you know, cranes all over the place, booming economy. March comes, everything gets, you know, comes to a halt depending on what state you were in to determine you know, what was going on here in Georgia, we were the first state that really kind of opened up and, you know, watch these other projects down the road, you know, going and, you know, and they put all the, you know, safety precautions in. Talk about how your company, you know, knowing that, you know, you’re one, you know, one of the big, you know, the big five, you know, in that accounting construction analyst kind of gig that, how your company weathered the storm and helped your clients and, maybe, you know, any new services that you’re coming out with that you think some of our listeners out there are commercial construction Coffee Talk, uh, might find of interest, yeah, I mean, we need, there was a lot that happened right from a finance, accounting, government regulation standpoint. I mean, between like PPP loans, between employee retention tax credits, um, there was a lot of government regulation that came out to help businesses and so, you know, what we did during that time aside from, you know, know if hey, everybody gets zoom and everybody, you know, gets all their, their technology equipment, etc, um, to be able to work remotely, you know, we what we really try to focus on is what is the government doing and how can we make this beneficial to our clients so, you know, we put out guidance on the employer retention tax credit, we put out guidance on PPP loans, you know, as things were coming out we were trying to, you know, read it as fast as you can and digest what’s happening and then be able to turn it around and say okay, here are the, the five industries or here are the, the clients that could be impacted by this, like let’s make sure we get in front of them and talk to them and share hey, like you should probably go be taking a PPP loan based on our understanding, you know, it’ll be forgiven we think that you have this much a payroll cover, uh, covered under this and you’d be able to benefit or saying, you know, in 2020 late, 2020 when the employee retention tax credit was a big focus and that came to fruition saying all right so you took your PPP loan is there still money there from an employee retention tax credit standpoint that you can take advantage of that’s all within laws and Regulations, right. Um, nothing we do, we don’t want to put people at risk, right? That’s one of our big things, right?

We want to make sure that what we’re telling clients is sound business tax economic advice and so, um, we did a lot of that and we continued to do that. I mean, the mantra of our firm is really just how do we help our clients and so, you know, we’re not out here trying to, at least, you know, the way I approach businesses, I’m not out here trying to make a ton of money right at, you know, if the money comes it’s great but you do right by people, that’s the way you do it and you build business so, um, you know, that’s really the approach that I took and our firm took with COVID and how we handled things, right? We were trying to take this approach of how can we get information to clients in the fastest, most effective, most efficient way so that they understand what’s happening in the industry. And when we look at construction, I mean, there was a lot of PPP loans that were given there, was a lot of opportunity to take employee retention tax credits depending on where you are in the country, depending on what type of industries you worked in, I mean, certain contractors, there was a big benefit, certain there was a big demise so it was just, you know, trying to bucket our clients and our prospects and just get in touch with people and make them aware of what was happening so that was kind of how we took our approach to COVID and you know, one of the things that came out of that was like I said, I took on the superhero role but we have this program it’s called the industry eminence program and where we have our senior analysts help to work with our chief economists to just find out and help forecast those trends and this program really took a step forward during the pandemic because people were unsure of what was happening, right? There wasn’t any clarity, they’re in a lot of different means and so, we were trying to take the approach from a business perspective like can we be that guiding clarity that clients and prospects and people in the industry are looking towards? So, you know, I think joining this program at that time was a really big step for me and um, I think it was beneficial to a lot of our clients to have access to us who were out here doing that research, spending the time at night looking out, you know, what are the tax laws, what are the PPP laws and what are those impacts and how do they translate from government regulation to industry and how’s it going to impact our clients on the back end so that was kind of the approach that we took and how we handled it. Um, I mean, I’m still, we’re still not fully back in the office.

I, I don’t think I’ve been to an office since, since March 2020 but that might be, uh, yeah, I think I’ve been to a couple but uh, I don’t know, yeah, my memory gets a little foggy, it’s the lack of sleep like we said it gets to you, you guys, you got a good excuse, it’s okay, you know. I’ll tell you, I knew so many companies that did PPP, uh, it was rolled out very, very, um, haphazardly, uh, a lot of banks didn’t really know what they were doing, uh, and uh, in my opinion, uh, but it’s definitely helpful to a lot of companies and uh, you know, they, that, that, you know, that got them through so, um, I’m glad that it was there. The ERTC I actually did a podcast on it, uh, uh, actually the program had changed originally you would just get the credit or whatever and now they gave you the cash where you didn’t have to, you know, so the program has had been upgraded and and um, but I did a PSA and I, you know, I told my clients I said look, you know, if uh, if you’ve got a plumber, uh, you know, you hire a plumber to do this so this ERTC my suggestion is go find people that are specialists in this that do it every day and they will definitely, you know, if you’ve got, you know, more than a couple of W-2s and they’re not family.

And all this stuff, so I try to pitch it to as many people as I could because I knew that that money could have made or break if they were going to stay in business or not and yeah, we had a couple clients that were getting, you know, million-dollar like multi-million dollars back from the ERTC, like so, you know, let alone the PPP money that they got then you’re getting a couple million dollars in tax credits and it really does help you stay in business, right? Like you’re, you know, we’re not in here trying to necessarily profit off this we’re just trying to help you get through what was an extremely challenging time for the industry so and that’s what I think the goal of those funds were it’s not necessarily to help make this the best year you’ve ever had it’s to help make sure that you’re able to keep your people employed and to keep the economy moving forward so, and I think it served its purpose, um, so it did what I was supposed to which was great yeah there’s actually still some money left in the ERTC I don’t know how much left but I mean there’s still money out there so listen if you if you have not gotten your ERTC done like I said my CPA these guys have meetings every day I mean so I’ve been with them for almost 25 years so when they they told me it’s like hey do this and you’ll get this credit and whatever and then they changed it now you actually get cash that you don’t have to reimburse to them and it’s not like the PPP and but you do have to give the you know your records and it takes about six months or so for you to to get that those funds but it’s well worth it so if you’ve not done the ERTC.

And you haven’t done it you know I don’t even think I have my affiliate link anymore but listen at the end of the episode and if you have not done it okay right let this specialist tell you how to do it because um it’s I help so many companies that to get money you know whether they were big or small as long as you have more than more than two W-2s and they’re not family related uh you have nothing to lose by lending someone a specialist look at it and because eventually those funds are going to run out and I don’t know if they’re going to redo the program or not it’s hard to say but but uh it really was an awesome program I’m actually pitching uh R&D grants right now um which is another thing that just came up and uh so I’ve I’m come I’ll be doing a podcast on that my another PSA you know as I learn all the little intricacies the ins and outs of it but that’s another really really cool program for for people that want to be innovative and you know that want to come out with new things and they can help you do the research and it you know so you know the government look they always take you know very very slow giving back but the ERTC the PPP you know it was really cool and the sovereignty Grant think that that’s out there right now uh these are all really cool things so if you don’t know about it talk to a specialist whether it’s an Ecker you can reach out to me or whoever it’s information’s power if you don’t know and then you’ll know right and that yeah right and I mean that R&D credit ties was kind of nicely until I got the report that we sent so you know our latest report we were putting out was just an outlook on kind of where things stand from a contact so construction technology standpoint and you know when as we were looking at trends in the industry we saw you know there’s a lot of money that’s going to be flowing into the industry right we got 1.2 trillion dollars from the infrastructure investment and jobs act you got 280 billion from the chips act you know the inflation reduction acts there’s it’s a little unclear how much was actually there but people are you know the estimate that we’ve seen is around 500 billion dollars from that.

And um the construction industry stands to Benefit from all these but when you look at productivity in the construction industry it’s actually been kind of stagnant over the past like 15 years. Um, in the report that we put out we were looking at since 2006 you know how has productivity grown in the industry. Um, and the Bureau of Labor and statistics tracks four different sectors within construction: single-family, multi-family, industrial building, and then Highway and Street productivity and the one that had the biggest gains was that Highway and Street productivity and it was an 18.4 gain in total over 15 years in productivity. It was like you compare that against manufacturing or against um the rest of the economy and the economy’s productivity was growing at 2.8 percent manufacturing was grown at 3.6 per year constructions growth rate was was like one percent per year and so and when we’re thinking about what companies can do and how they can um make improvements going forward in productivity and you know using that R&D looking into technology to make improvements this is an area that we see a big opportunity. Um, you know the productivity levels and construction are tend to be low from a variety of reasons but one of those is the failure to invest in new technology. Um, we’re seeing and we’re hearing from a lot of the tech companies that we work with that there has actually been a pretty big push um in the VC space and and the capital flow has actually grown substantially in the construction technology space so in 2014 uh, there was about 1.4 billion dollars in capital raise for construction technology companies on 136 different deals uh, while we’re looking at 2021 that number had exploded to 12.3 billion in funds raised or Capital raised on 626 deals.

So in seven years the total funds rates had gone up 10 billion dollars basically tenfold um and the number of deals had gone up about five-fold so there is a big opportunity to invest in construction but when we talked to a lot of our construction companies there’s still challenges that they face and they don’t really know how to approach that um, you know they face the challenge of there’s a huge industry fragmentation a lot of construction companies are super small most have less than 10 employees the margins are super thin right average operating margin for a construction company is somewhere between three and seven percent average IT investment is is the lowest out of all the industries that we track which came in at one to two percent of total revenue so average IT Investments earn average IT space and in a given year as a percent of Revenue is one to two percent uh the average for most Industries is three to four percent so you know the construction industry has a long way to go to make these productivity improvements and so our report was really getting at like how do you go about an investing contact um and we really break it down to three things right one you need to figure out where you currently are two you need to figure out where you want to be and three you need to figure out how you get there yeah how you get there right it’s like you know where do I where am I where do I want to go and what’s the map and you know when we’re talking to clients um where they currently are um we there’s really like three things again that you should be doing so assessing what are your capabilities what’s your technology what’s your stack you know your technology stack look like uh have a quick story that I went into a contractor.

Um and I was I was going to just do this current state evaluation for them and we’re asking them just write down all the technology that you pay for like all the licenses everything that you pay for and so I’m reviewing the list and I’m like you have you have 20 licenses for Tableau which is a bi tool and you have 20 licenses for Power BI which is the Microsoft version of the BI tool. I’m like these do the exact same thing. I don’t think you’re paying for, you’re paying double. Yeah, you’re betting double and it’s just you know having that assessment and looking at it and saying what am I actually paying for, uh, you know that that is helpful in a lot of ways to say am I using this. Um, and then there’s the other piece within how do you figure out where you currently are like what data are you collecting? Um, there was an FMI study that showed that not 95 of data collected on construction companies goes unused. It’s like why are you collecting data if you’re not going to use it? Um, and then the other piece of it is how are you using it and where are you using that? So you know the other big challenge that I see with current state for a lot of these companies is they’re all using Excel spreadsheets. Uh, I don’t know how many times I talked with clients and it’s like I keep my estimates in this Excel spreadsheet. I’m like well that’s great you know it’s better than keeping it in paper but it’d be awesome if you had the ability to say all right what happens if I have a 10 erosion across this job like what happens if I have a 10 gain on my margin on this job what happens if you know X Y and Z happens.

And Excel is very limited in the ability to do that so having other tools and putting it in other systems and other technology that allow you to make those types of decisions and perform that type of analysis is really important and then the second step right figure out where you want to be so if you’re a construction company and you’re looking like do you want to grow are you looking to expand in new territories do you want to use data to drive your decisions um how much money are you willing to spend on content like those are really important questions that you need answered because you know if and to help do that third step which is that map so if you want to grow right you might be looking into standardizing your processes and that starts with knowing and documenting and understanding what that process is um if you’re looking to or if you’re willing to spend a ton of money they have one company that I was working with that decided they they really wanted to invest in in technology and they essentially wanted to turn the the entire face of the organization from being instead of being a construction company it’s really being a technology company so they invested a ton of money into what is essentially like an incubator within the company where they they have all these small technology um companies that invest in construction related technology come and Pitch them and what they do is they’ll they’ll select the best ones deploy them on a subset of jobs see if that technology actually works actually makes them better and if it does then they invest in that company so then you become an owner in that company right and this is a super costly expensive way of doing it but it’s a it it’s one way to get involved um become invested in content so um.

I really like to tell people like you can do this a whole bunch of different ways and you can invest in technology in a lot of a lot of different ways like I I was reading about Textura when I was putting this together the billing application I’m sure you’re familiar um so Textura does the automated payment applications right so a big back in like the 2000s uh, three guys from PricewaterhouseCoopers one of the largest accounting firms in the country and world world basically said we’re going to step away and we’re going to build this platform to help automate Billings for construction companies and now when I was I’ve talked to a couple of our larger General Contractors and they said if the subcontractors that they’re they’re working with aren’t willing to be on Textura they’ll automatically just qualify them from.

like a bid right so it’s that important to them. Um, to be able to automate this process because they don’t want to have somebody sitting there opening up mail to input data into their system they want it all to just transfer over easily. Um, and one of the clients I was talking to said by moving from manual to like a manual process to using textura they were able to reduce the need for accountants from three full-time accountants per project to just one per project. That’s three accountants you know you’re losing two accountants per job and we’re in this environment like we said where labor challenges continue to be an issue and to be able to gain an efficiency like that is huge. So you know when we’re when we’re looking and talking about construction technology and contact I mean I think there’s a huge opportunity ahead um. I would really encourage a lot of companies to to look at what they can do to um to be a part of that like it doesn’t you don’t need to create a venture capital firm within your company to be able to invest in contact you just have to be willing to make change and make that continuous Improvement um but the quote you know one of the quotes that um I hear I’ve seen is from Vincent van Gogh and he says great things are done by a series of small things brought together and so think of that you know as you’re you’re building your contact investment right you just use that small use those small incremental changes and they can lead to a huge opportunity or a big change down the road for your company so I.

I’ve I mean I think there’s a huge opportunity in that space and it’s really passionate about it and you know I’m I’m excited to see where construction technology goes because I do think there is a big opportunity going forward in that space yeah you know listen uh I kept my family’s been in construction since 1888 there have been a demolition and uh you know I spent my days growing up at the scrapyard we lived out just 15 min you know minutes west of uh Valley Forge outside of Philadelphia and uh you know what it’s this sixth generation and my cousins are running it and uh but you know when we all got our driver’s licenses we all had to go spend our summers you know getting up at the crack of dawn and working for my Uncle Frank the super you know in the in the scrap yard and um uh and but myself I built this magazine I used to do with paper ink and you know editorial Etc now I do it digitally and I’ve spent the last year uh you know learning everything digital that you can imagine you know from AI to uh uh you know uh you know doing Clips Tick Tock marketing I mean everything and um uh it’s I thought I knew a lot but I didn’t and uh it’s me and I’m in this class right now and I’m just about I’ve got a couple classes left and and uh it’s mind-blowing how much money I have left on the table in my business and um but all these things that I’m on a platform where I can know I have all these you know I’m a digital guy so uh you know I’ve got the I’ve got this plug-in I’ve got the app and you know but now like I have one login and I’ve it’s taken me time to push everything over but now everything is intertwined and it’s on one platform and the data you know I’m addicted to data that I I can’t get enough of it.

I am too yeah I’m gonna take you to it so you know I don’t I still use spreadsheets you know you know simple stuff but the bottom line is is that the more you know uh the easier it’s gonna get and once it’s set up it makes your life so much be easier being autonomous and um and uh like last night I went down after I got done with this class and I went down I was talking to my wife I’m like you’re not gonna believe what I just saw oh you know it with this with this software and you know what it can do and uh just from a Marketing standpoint. This whole, that’s why I got into the R&D. I had this guy, and we were talking last December, and I said, “Well look, you know we’ll look at it,” and I told him what I was doing. He’s like, “Hey, you’re just a typical, you know, you’re just a little guy, but at least you’re looking at it. You know there are some contractors that don’t even have a smartphone, you know, that are out there, or they’re still using slide rules for those who don’t know what that is. That was the way we used measure things. But the bottom line is, you know, the big guy, you know, there’s the big guns, those guys are technologically advanced. But then like you said, you know, there’s a lot of firms, you know, have, you know, three or four people and they probably are living on those spreadsheets and it’s very cumbersome. Not that they don’t work, but it’s like push button 101. Once you, what the click and where everything needs to go, it’ll make your life so much easier. And the use of AI, I mean, I’m not sure how much you’ve done with ChatGPT lately and you, I mean, you’ve probably had, you probably had a bunch of people who want to talk about this, um, but you know AI’s been around for a long, long time. It’s just, a long time just became mainstream.

Yeah, yeah, it’s like a mainstream maybe the last 18 months, you know, they, you need the AI, you know, but it’s been around for a long time, like I’ve hooked up. I’m in this Elite Class with these guys and, uh, you know, there’s digital dudes. They’ve been, they’ve been their online marketers anyway, these guys have made 12 figures and one guy’s, the guys like in his mid-40s and these guys are unbelievable and the amount of knowledge that they know and, uh, I get all these classes and, you know, and I’m just, I’m just blown away of what they can do and, and they make it simple. You know, it was, uh, the other night they showed me this, they were using the software where I can go in and, you know, whether it’s a 10 mile radius or 100 or nationally and I can look at where my ranking is on Google and then you can look in and see where what your competitors are and it’s a simple little thing. Green is go, red is bad, you’re stuck, you’re stuck at the red light. So you can look at someone and say, look, you want to be green, you don’t want to be red, and these are the things that you need to do to get it to get you there and I can help you or you can try to do it yourself but the bottom line is and it’s so easy to look at if you keep it simple, keep it simple, you know, keep it simple stupid and, uh, and but I’m all about technology because I want to make things as simple as I can and, um, it, uh, you know, I just put an IT column in my magazine. That’s how passionate I am about it so I’ve just put this, it column in and, uh, we’ll talk about, you know, information and, you know, cybersecurity and all this other stuff that everybody has to do with but, uh, I saw that you know it was a necessary, you know, component, you know, in my magazine as a destination spot for people consuming content and, uh, you know, so I just tell people look, technology, you got to embrace it and it doesn’t matter how old you are, you can always learn it.

Don’t be scared of it, you’re going to make mistakes, you make mistakes on construction projects, you roll with the punches right why you have a punch list so you can fix things so right so but technology is the name of the game and, uh, you know, AI like I just did my with my living wills, uh, you know, my son’s moved out we had to get them updated and I and my attorney’s okay now I’m like no I’m gonna do on an AI hey I can do it for me and, uh, I and I’ll get it notarized and it’ll be it’ll be legit so they have it curate my grocery list for me every single week I tell it here are my parameters and I say you know here’s what I like I don’t I’m not a big fish eater so I doubt it make five dinners For two people and like I don’t, you know, one of them doesn’t like fish, and that it curates the entire list, and I say, “Okay, now put that in my grocery list with like, here’s all the recipes that you’ll eat and then here’s the list of all the products you need to buy,” and then I’ll tell it, “Okay, like, great, here’s the list, I go through, all right, I have that, I have that, I have that,” so like then I’m just down to, okay, I have these 10 things, and then I tell it, “Send me the recipes,” and I was like, it’s all there, right? It’s, I don’t have to think about what I want to eat anymore. I just have it tell me what I want to eat, which is a little scary because it might be taught me to eat things I shouldn’t be eating. But you know, well that’s the thing, you know, like, like that’s the thing about AI, you teach it how it learns from you so the more you could put in it the better it gets at it and, uh, and listen there’s some biased ones out there I I don’t get into all that so I’m using it for what I want it to do and, uh, like I have people all the time send me a, you know, content and I look, I’m like, look, I know you’re using AI but you really still need to use your head and AI can only do so much you still have to put bullet points in and you know, you know but it makes their life so much easier it can give you such a quicker Foundation to, to you to do whatever you’re doing and then you can implement it and it can help you. I mean last night he was showing me, uh, you know we were looking at, uh, you know different categories or whatever and he pulled up a personal injury, you know and AI just said we want to know the top cities that have injury the top 100 cities that do injury and boom it was there like in two seconds and then you know we manipulated for you know what it’s just you know but yeah yeah so if you don’t if you don’t use it you know you should and, uh, you’d be amazed at what you can do with it and, uh, um, and just the basics.

I mean like you don’t even have to get like not even the complex things right there’s a lot of complex things you can take and you can make it a lot easier but like just think about those simple things that you could just have it do on a daily basis for you it’s great it’s fantastic. I had I had a, I had a guy you know it’s called Uh truebill he saw for a guy out in, uh, in uh, the West Coast anyway John was on the podcast and I said look before we do it I said look we’ll do a little five ten minute demo and you can and this is for subcontractors so he, he didn’t, uh, how do I do U.S gypsum with three-quarter inch you know thickness you know and anyway and then he spitted it out and he, uh, he reissued the question and and so people could actually see actually this is you know this is just a simple way how you can learn to use it and, um, uh, and it’s just through trial and effort you know trying to figure out and so, uh, I, I you know AI I’m kind of, I’m kind of a fence sitter I like being on the fence you know it’s kind of like when a new phone comes out our new truck I don’t want to buy right away because I know there’s going to be bugs in it so I’d like to have it you know be used and then fix and then I’m going to be ready to buy but but I want to check it out and try it you know I want to test drive it but I’m not going to purchase it till I know all the bugs are kind of you know and everything’s got you know that kind of stuff yeah everything so and there’s always continuous right it’s like uh you fix this problem and next thing you know something else yeah exactly so yeah I don’t know it’s great I mean it’s fun and it’s cool to see and it’s great to have that advancement in society to like make it should make your life easier right that’s the goal of Technology yet I always tell myself you know we we talk a lot about people processing technology and I say it’s always that order like you the people are first like you have to have the people in place then you have to have the process then you have to have the technology and and when I think about AI I’m like oh you know everything AI is.

Doing should be to make people’s lives easier. Like, it’s working for us that we’re not working for it. And that’s what we need to remember. It’s like it’s there to make your life easier, so allow it to make your life easier. Yeah. So if someone out there on Commercial Construction Coffee Talk wanted to, you know, bounce some questions off you, you know, whether it’s for the grand side of thing erotc, you know, just financial forecasting, whatever it might be, how would they reach out to you?

You can, uh, you can email me. So, obviously, uh, an easy one. So it’s Nick, N-I-C-K, dot Brandi, G-R-A-N-D-Y, at rsmus.com. Or you can hit me up on LinkedIn. Um, always taking friend requests, so, you know, just send me a message saying, “Hey, I listened to you on the Commercial Construction Coffee Talk, you know, want to connect on this?” So that way I can make sure I send it over to David so that he knows that, you know, hey, these people are, these are the people that we’re, you know, we’re hearing from. And yeah, sure, just love to be able to talk to everybody and be able to help anybody out that I can. That’s our goal here at RSM. And that’s my goal personally, is to, you know, let’s do what we can to help you. I’m always appreciative of that. So, hey, can you, you can even talk skiing if you want, or you know, diapers, how, what’s the best way to do this, you know? You should be a professional diaper guy these days. So, yeah, you can ask them all sorts of stuff, not just contact. So, I’m gonna, I’m gonna be talking myself going forward, saying how long has it taken me to do this, see if I can set some records. If anybody wants to reach me, you can get me at davidc at CCR Dash mag.com. Listen, uh, we like looking at everything just like, uh, you know, next publicist, they sent me the press release, I looked at it, he got on the plane, we put it up on the web. In fact, I’ve done a lot of press releases or posts for RSM over the over the last, you know, couple of years and, um, uh, so look, don’t judge a book by cover. I always tell people it’s like playing the lottery. If you don’t buy a ticket, you can’t win. If you don’t tell me something, I can’t look at. And it can be anything. It could be an anniversary for your company. It could be a new person on a new project, a new, uh, you know, whatever you have. Uh, and listen, you know, before you know, the roller coaster started, I would just post construction stuff up there, but now I found out that there’s more to work in life, you know, more to life than just work. And, uh, so I put all sorts of stuff there. How to buy a cell phone, you know, what’s the best insurance to have, how to buy, you know, your new pizza grill or whatever it might be.

So, I’ve got all sorts of stuff out there. And, uh, you know, we share, we sing in the, you know, URL so you can put on your social media. It’s a win-win. It’s good for both of our SEOs, that search engine optimization, if you don’t know what that is. And, uh, that’s how Google finds you. And, uh, 90% of the people are using Google to buy stuff. And they’re all on your phone. This is your best tool that you can ever have in your arsenal. And as a construction guy, it’s have your phone and use it wisely because you’re tied to eight billion people on the planet that also have them. So, uh, it’s an amazing, amazing tool. So send me something. I come back to you, T-A-T, turnaround time, you know, probably, you know, two to three days, but I’ll come back or my digital specialist will. Kim and, you know, we look at everything we posted. We post every day. We’ve got plenty of lab. Very tough to get in the magazine. But the bottom line is we look at everything and, uh, you know, it’s a win-win. So, you know, send me stuff, um, and, uh, we’ll get it out there. So, uh, Nick, if you wanted to leave one positive thought or phrase with our listeners out there, what would it be?

Yes, we go into the weekend, you know, and you know, Q4 and finish the year out. Yeah. I mean, I think that Vincent van Gogh quote hits it hits it well, you know, great things are done. By a series of small things brought together. So, you know, don’t dive in too deep. Don’t try too hard. Just take it one day, one step, one minute, one second at a time. And, you know, change happens with the smallest little piece, so just focus on that and, you know, it’ll happen. Yeah. I’ll tell you, I have a, you know, my digital agency that I’m building, and you know, I post every day on there, and you know, I put code, so I just put one up the other day: Decide, Succeed, Repeat. And uh, that’s what I’m gonna, uh, you know, it’s kind of just, uh, the same thing with technology: decide what you want to do, succeed on learning how to use it, and then repeat. And uh, your life will be so much, you know, so much smoother. So, uh, that, that’s good. That’s what I’m gonna leave with you all out there on Commercial Construction Coffee Talk. But I like the Van Gogh quote too, so, you know, I’m always like, hey, you small wins, big wins, they don’t matter. It all adds up, you know, the sum is always bigger than the whole. So, you know, don’t, don’t just because you don’t get that huge project, a lot of little ones, they all add up. So, uh, you know, I’m right there with you. Um, so with that said, couple things before we end this episode. Uh, number one, I want you to hit the like button, okay? Because we want to, we want to let everybody find out about Nick and, you know, and uh, if he’s learning, if he’s going to be the professional, uh, you know, baby diaper changer that he is, uh, but uh, hit the like button so we get the algorithm so people will find this episode and we really appreciate that. You know, if you’re out there on Commercial Construction Coffee Talk land, out on the web, you know, that like button is very important to us. Uh, and uh, you know, we grow our Channel every day.

I’ve got over 550 videos on our Channel and it just keeps on growing. So we appreciate that, so hit that like button. Number two, if you’re on a construction site, be safe, okay? We want you to get home so you can change diapers like, you know, Nick is all right, or whatever, but we want you to be safe and be able to go out and do it again the following day. All right, very, very important. Number three, it’s still hot out there, okay? So, we don’t want you to get dehydrated. When you’re dehydrated, get headaches, uh, you know, and that’s when the accidents happen. So make sure you drink lots of water out in the site and get some of those electrolyte powders and put them in your water bottle or whatever, drink lots of liquids, you’re going to save yourself because dehydration is just the worst, okay? And uh, like I said, we want you to be safe out there. Um, so with that said, Nick, pleasure. Listen, uh, you’re ski bum, hey, maybe, uh, we’ll, uh, we’ll, uh, talk on the chairlift somewhere, uh, you know, in North Carolina, you know, above Asheville or whatever, uh, you know, a couple hours around for me in the winter and I’ll, uh, we’ll go skiing, you know, I would love that, we definitely got to make that happen. Next time, next time in the summer, it’s a great ride up to Asheville from where I’m at, you know, on the motorcycle, but uh, listen, this game’s only a couple hours away depending on, you know, if how warm it is and, you know, if they’re doing the snow machines, you know, blowing snow and stuff, but uh, you know, maybe we’ll hook up, uh, but I’ve thoroughly enjoyed the conversation, you know, listen, you talk to CPAs, you’re like, oh my God, dry, you know, whatever, listen, I live it, you know, I do my own books, so I’m an accountant, so I get it, you know, I’m just a little guy, but uh, I know how important it is and like I said, if you’re in business three people, Doctor, attorney, CPA, and you’re covered, you’re good, all right, gotta keep your spouse happy too, that’s the most important, so um, anyway, listen, it’s TGIF, like I said, the weekend’s upon us, relax, clear your mind, get rid of the negativity, stay positive, you got the short holiday week coming up next week and uh, and then we’re all going to come back and before you know it, it’s going to be Halloween, Thanksgiving, Hanukkah, Christmas, boom, this year is going to be over and then we’re going to go into 2024, you know, and it’s been a while while ride in 2023, you know, I mean it’s, uh, it’s just been crazy. I mean, every day I get up and I’m so mentally drained of everything that I’ve learned and I stay away from all.

The news and all the stuff that I can’t change it anyway. I can’t change the weather. I just gotta roll with the punches. But I’m telling you, it’s an exciting time to be alive, you know, in the world today. There’s just so much going on and uh, and there’s a lot of positive stuff. You just have to find it. And uh, you know, I always look at the glass, you know. I had a guy on yesterday, you know, it’s not the glass half, it’s just having that glass in your hand that you’re lucky, you know. So, you know, like I said, this weekend, clear, you know, mindset is everything, okay? And with the mindset, you’re going to be able to find out how you’re going to get there, because if you have a negative mindset, you’re not going to get there. But if you have a positive mindset, hey, you know what, I actually can get this done, you know. And most some people get things done quicker than others, but as long as you’re moving forward and not looking backwards, you’re going to get there, okay? And I, I like this one, one of my quote, my favorite quotes and then we’ll close this up is, you’ll be so psyched if you start something year from now you’ll look back and say, “God, I’m so glad I did it,” you know, but if you don’t do it, you’re not going to be able to do it. So, well, Nick, congratulations on your baby girl. Welcome to the south in North Carolina. And uh, you know, enjoy your weekend and uh, you know, you deserve some time off and uh, have a, you know, killer wrestler Q3 and moving into Q4 and uh, I look forward to meeting you, you know, no fist pumps, we’ll shake hands and uh, listen, if we don’t go skiing, a we’ll go hit the links, you know, I’d like to see another hole in one, I’ve never seen one, uh, in person, so that would be awesome to see lightning strike again, you know, I would love to make that happen. So yeah, so say goodbye to our listeners out there. Our Commercial Construction Coffee Talk from Raleigh, yeah, goodbye everybody, thank you again for listening and thank you, David, for the time, really appreciate it and I’m gonna sign off from Sugar Hill, uh, just below the Beaufort Dam on Lake Lanier, about 30 miles north of downtown Atlanta, the LA and the South and uh, we will see you next time on another episode of Commercial Construction Coffee Talk. Nick, thoroughly enjoy the conversation. All right, I appreciate the time, we’ll see you next time. Ciao.